Can you give an example of a time where you said no? Even if the technology was popular?

I was “no” on cloud for a long time; that is, on everybody's definition on cloud. First of all, initially, there was no clear definition, and although that has since changed, initially you didn’t know who the customer was on cloud, and how Red River specifically was going to work in there and bring any value.

Over the past two years, the definition has gotten cleaner and we … understand the hybrid model (better). But originally, everyone was just suggesting going 100 percent to public cloud and now they understand that it is a different world.

So, now we do quite a bit of cloud … now this is the time for that.